Wednesday, January 19, 2011

Controversial Topic...Marriage.

I want to talk about marriage for a moment.

It all started when I watched Piers Morgan the other night and his guest was Oprah. I was startled by her deviant tone when asked about marriage. It seemed to be more than her just being sick of this question. It seemed when she pointed her finger and contorted her face that it took an ugly turn. She was so adamant that it seemed she meant something more than she was saying. I couldn't stop thinking about it. It got Rick and I discussing it because he too noticed it right away.  It left us both scratching out heads trying to understand.
If I were going to give a smart ass quip I would say, “If people spent as much time thinking about the actual marriage as they do the dress, party and ring we would have more happy marriages.”
But we all know it probably isn’t that simple right?

I was never one of those girls who dreams of this fairytale wedding and dress and all the hoopla that goes with it. Never was my thing. I get it though if it was your dream it just wasn’t mine. So over the years I understood when she said if she wanted a party she'd have one and buy a great dress. But marriage is more than a party so that flippant answer didn't fly that night either.

The first time around I truly believed I was fully and totally in love but the problem was I was 23. At 23 I was not fully formed enough to be married. Not enough life experience to be married. (this is just me I refer to, you may have been much more mature than I)
I may have been pretty close but not quite. If I had been more enlightened per se I would have seen the signs 'cause they were huge and I would have let it run its course. But I wasn’t that astute to really see what I needed to see. And I didn’t have a mom or dad to assist with that either. But I loved him and I still have a high regard for him. I have never understood women or men who have such vile disdain for their ex’s. You married him/her how did it go from love to hate? But I digress.

I worked through all the pain, went back to school and my career took off. I had no desire to get married again. I didn’t want children so I just didn’t feel I needed marriage for any reason.  But I knew I didn’t want to be alone my whole life. The idea of someone sharing my life with me was something I knew I did want.  As my life moved forward I just kept saying I wasn’t going to be married ever again.

But as time went on and I found myself in a long term loving relationship we moved in together. I began to wonder what is the difference really?
Someone said to me that not being married meant I could walk away easily.
WOW. I wouldn’t want to leave easily. And if I did what the hell kind of relationship am I in then? What kind of love and commitment to the relationship walks away easily? I then realized that I was just scared. But why? I was going to be just as hurt if he left me if I was married or unmarried. It would be just as devastating either way so why was I doing this?

I played this over and over again in my head a lot back then. One day I just realized I was being so foolish. No, I didn’t need that piece of paper as unmarried people love to say, but yet why was it such a big deal not to have it then? It really shouldn’t matter. Isn’t living together a real commitment just like marriage? Either way I realized it was the same exact thing to me.

This man I married was the big love of my life. I knew that. He asked me to marry him 2 times and I said," no let’s not mess with this." Then he asked me a 3rd time and as he likes to say, “The 3rd time was the charm” I said yes. He told me once that “he was committed to the commitment as well as me and that was never going to change whether married or not.” I so loved that line. In other words, we may have difficult times but he was there for the distance to work through it all. He was making a commitment to me either way. He wasn’t running away easily from a few bumps in the road. Isn’t that what everyone wants?
Isn't that a relationship whether married or living together?

For some reason after I said yes it was like everything I was thinking and feeling about marriage was gone. Oh I didn’t want a big dress and big hoopla….so not my things. We ran away and got married in a flower filled gazebo over the beach in the Caribbean. It was intimate and perfect for us. I didn’t get married for the party or the jewelry I got married for the man and partnership in life. (but I did eventually get that rock....tee hee)

This brings me to Oprah, who on Monday night while speaking with Piers Morgan said that she would never ever marry Stedman. That they both feel that if they had gotten married it wouldn’t have worked. She said this so adamantly and strongly and it felt ugly.. How would anything change? They live together now and have for over 20 years and share a life together. What is she not saying?

Hey if they don't want to get married I surely don't give a hoot. I am all for people doing whatever floats their boat. All people have and should have that right.
But what stood out to me was the way she answered the question. It had such undertones, but she never explained other than it would never work. What would they do to one another that they wouldn’t do only living together? I just don’t understand that and I do want to see that point of view.  I do understand the money thing in the event of a divorce. But then do a pre-nup. I am all for pre-nups, whether Oprah or me.  So taking that out of the equation what is the difference between living together and getting married? (she’d sure save on taxes!!)

And if you are living together so you can have a quick get away then how committed are you? Why would you live with someone who is so not committed to you that walking away easily is their thought process? Besides, the only thing quick is your exit because there is still baggage and thinking there isn’t is damn foolish. You’ll still have pain, you’ll still have to split all the things you’ve acquired together just like a marriage. And there can be times when lawyers are involved in both scenarios so I don’t get the difference.

Someone said they didn’t need that piece of paper. Okay, I get that I really do.
What surprised us both was that after we got married it did change. We both honestly felt that after our marriage it only deepened and grew. But we both have said we don’t think we did anything consciously to do that you know? It just did. Was that just us?

For Oprah being so fully evolved as she called herself a few times that night, I think this is a big fat question that she will never deal with and there are huge holes in her theory to me.
Or am I missing something?  Did I just not get it?
Your thoughts?

20 comments:

Raquel's World said...

Well call me Oprah!
I have been with David for 12 years and I do not really care to marry him. Why? I am not entirely sure. We both have been divorced and he has asked me to marry him 5 times. I plan on being with him forever or at least a really long time I just don't see the point.
In our case, we already share expenses and have kids and live together. One day we may marry, but I just really don't see the point. It's just another thing on a to do list.
I have given thought to the fact that my rights are considerably lower in the event that he dies, or is injured. And I have also thought about the example I am
setting for my kids. Wouldn't it be nice if mommy and daddy married?
I think we are scared. You always hear about the couple that was together 10 years then got married and divorced in 2.

Margaret (Peggy or Peg too) said...

Okay Roc I get your point - it was mine for years. i understand.
Why do you think people get married and divorce in 2. It's all curious to me.
But honestly Oprah's tone was what threw me!

Raquel's World said...

Not sure what it is about getting married that pushes the relationship to change. I suspect that maybe when people get married the expectations change a bit. Or the relationship was already in trouble and they married in a foolish attempt to save it?
I wish I could've seen this interview. I saw one with her and Barbara Walters when marriage came up she did not seem as deviant.
Maybe she was in a bad mood.

Margaret (Peggy or Peg too) said...

Maybe because it wasn't live and the way it was edited. It just really stood out to me and I was so curious. I don't care if she gets married or not. I don't care if anyone does or doesn't as I said. To each their own. Everyone needs to do what they feel is best for them. I think it caught me off guard because she is always touting her being so "aware" and "in the moment" and "enlightened" yet she danced on this topic and was neither honest or forthcoming and it felt like she was hiding something.

In the big scheme of things - no big deal right? :-)

Yankee Girl said...

I don't know why people do that either.

I think that some people just want to make a statement about not being married, though I have no idea what that statement would be. Though I am just speculating, I wouldn't be surprised of Oprah didn't get married simply because she really likes when everyone asks her if it will ever happen.

And I'm not an Oprah fan, so my opinion is skewed...I think she does it all for the attention she will constantly bring to herself.

Jessie at Luna Pacifica said...

I love this post!

I did everything backwards to society's standards. I had the babies before marriage, marriage before college...blah blah blah.

I liked planning the wedding. I liked the pretty magazines and all that happy horse shit. I was in a manic phase so planning the wedding was euphoric! But I always had a level head about marriage itself. There is no real 50/50 give and take in marriage. I knew that it was going to be work and that the first few years were going to be about compromise but more importantly sacrifice, for the sake of balance.

I do believe that having sacrificed so much in my youth in order to be a good mother to my children has helped me be a better partner. I learned how to be selfless for someone else.

Ryan and I have had great times and we've had hard times. Very very hard times. Times where we were ready to break our vows and tear up our 'piece of paper'. But, for us, the children hold us together better than our license. We always find a way to work out our troubles because we both honor our vows.

Neither asks too much of the other and no one gives up their identity or passions for stability. Someone gives up something or changes their perspective in order to maintain the balance of the marriage. In fact, we have created a common identity and common passions as a couple. This, I believe, is the key. It binds us together.

I end with this: Our vows state that "Marriage is giving up the search to find oneself and instead holding hands and finding each other together. Partner, lover, and accomplice."

Ps. Oprah is the devil and anything she says is crap to me. Don't get me started on that lady. ;-)

alessandra said...

I think it's about freedom, the freedom to choose every single day if you want to stay together or not.
And when you marry, in a way or another that freedom is gone, but I agree with you that living together is very close to marriage. :)

Margaret (Peggy or Peg too) said...

Alessandra - I don't see how that freedom is gone in marriage. With a 50% divorce rate in America I do not think that is stopping any one.

If one can't make a committment to not run when the going gets tough or they don't like something then why live with each other to begin with? Living together or married is both a committment. I'd live in my own place if I was sure I wanted the freedom to walk on any given day. But again, that's just me.

Margaret (Peggy or Peg too) said...

Yankee Girl - who knows maybe she does do it for attention. God knows she doesn't need anymore. You would have hated how he kissed her ass then. It was sickening. He called her the Queen of all Media. (barf) I don't hate her, I don't love her. I find her an interesting specimen and that she says one thing but lives another. And yet no one calls her one it.

mamahasspoken said...

Won't say that I love Oprah or hate her either. How about indifferent? I'm just throwing this out there, it might stick, it might not, it might cause a stir but oh well, here it goes.
I think it's not her but him. They are my age maybe older. We grew up where the husband was the main provider, wifey could work but not make as much as the hubby. I do make more money than hubby and we've talked about it before. There are many men out there who would not be able to handle this.
If Stellman was to marry her, he would always be refered to or known as 'Mr. Oprah' which can be a hard thing for any man.
I also think it might be a power thing for her and she doesn't want the 50/50 that a marriage has.

regan said...

I didn't see the interview, but I'm guessing her hidden reason is all about the pre-nup! To have a pre-nup would mean that somewhere in the back of your mind, you don't think this is going to last somehow! And isn't she the 'all-knowing, all powerful "O"', and I would think people would be wild over her 'insecurity' of the relationship to require one! That said, she is way to big of a money hoarder to ever give up 1/2 of her fortune to some schmo just cuz she didn't want to look insecure. So, there is no way out for her....poor, poor Oprah!

I'm delighting in this dilemma of hers, because yes, she is the devil!

alessandra said...

You are right again, but you see people change with time ;)

Margaret (Peggy or Peg too) said...

Mama - get that point about Stedman although I'm in the same age category. My hubby used to say when I made a helluva lot more than he - I don't care how the money gets in the house just so it gets in the house. And when I got the promotion he was my biggest cheerleader. But some old people like my father always had a comment. Interesting. I like the "indifferent" part. That's me.

Margaret (Peggy or Peg too) said...

Regan - i crack up that everyone gives her all this power like she's the Queen or the Devil. She is not that important on either end of the spectrum. She thinks she is though doesn't she? :-)

Charlene said...

In my personal opinion at 59 years of age, I do not want to marry again. I have been married and happily so, but that ended when he died and I don't want to be married again. Lenny and I have been together 2 years when we were in high school and then 27 years later we've been together 14 years, though we don't live together. He's like the contry song: Live close and visit often!

Margaret (Peggy or Peg too) said...

Charlene - yours is a different situation. :-)

Anonymous said...

this is such an interesting post and i really dont know how i feel about it. on the one hand, i dont understand people who seem to be vehemently against marriage but on the other hand, if i were asked to argue points for marriage, i really dont know what my argument would be. i mean, i love jay and out little life together, but i think i'd feel the same way if we weren't married, if we had just been living together for years. i dont know if actually being married has made it better/worse/different.

i will say that if anything ever happens to me and jay, i dont see myself getting married again. not really because im anti marriage, but because i think id just like to be alone for awhile. maybe thats what oprah wants-her alone time. :)

Margaret (Peggy or Peg too) said...

Tammie - hey I got married due to taxes so what the hell do i know. I just felt Oprah was lying. I felt she was saying one thing and doing another. She lives with him full time so where is her alone time?
Personally I would love it if Rick lived next door. Perfect situation really.

Anonymous said...

interesting, i didnt know they lived together. but yeah, i agree with you, there is something odd about her not marrying stedman.

i was going to mention that! a long time ago i read about a married couple in NYC who had seperate apartments. at the time i had only been married a short while and thought it was just horrible. now that ive been married for almost 14 years, i think its the best idea ever and i really wish i could afford another place.

Margaret (Peggy or Peg too) said...

Tammie - when our neighbor was moving i told Rick that I would move there. He could stop by and take the garbage out and do his manly chores....which he took to mean sex and I meant garbage, killing bugs, yard work etc.